Bill: Let me give a little introduction here. This is Bill Schneider and Wendy Arundale and we're working with Faye Nusunginya and Charlie and Mary Edwardsen are going to help us. We are going to talk about the history of the Ikpikpuk River, what you remember when you were a little girl traveling there. You look awfully young, so I don't know when that was. Faye: I am eight-three, pretty soon eighty-four in September. Charlie: Maaŋŋa allaġataqhusi tatpauŋa tagraqsaġuurusi? (You would leave from here to travel by boat upriver?) Faye: Ii, tainnaġuurut kiuvva. Uvva Ikpikpakkun piruakun piviŋa? (Yes, because they always do that. Are you referring to travel through the Ikpikpak?) Mary: Ii. (Yes.) Faye: Tainnakiuvva uvaŋa nalugaluaġitka tainna qaŋapak pisuumarut. Umiamik, umianik pivḷutik aullaġuumarut. June-mi tarva samma around June tainna aullaġuumarut Ikpikpakun. Tainna suniḷuktuatkii. (Even though I do not know them myself, they always traveled in this way. With a boat, they would leave using boats. In the month of June, somewhere around June, they would leave through the Ikpikpak. They would be trying to do things.) Mary: Isumaaluktuat ami aŋuniaġukhutikkii. (They were probably thinking about the need to hunt.) Faye: Ii. Nutqaŋaaŋitchut ipkua taipkua iñuich, paŋmatun iñuusimik iñuusiqaŋitchut, aglaan piñaqtuaq nuna. Ivaavlugu qiñaavlugu paqiłhiñaġaġigaat iniksraqtik, inilluatauyumiñaqtuaq ukiuqpan, naagga upinġaakkaluami. Tainnatun. Uumiŋauvva iḷallakumiñaġiñ nalugalualaġma? (Yes. Those people back then did not stay put at one place, they did not have the lifestyle of today, but the land was such that there was food to be had. They went looking for a suitable place to live, where it would be a good place to live when the winter came, or even in the summer. This way. Can you add that on, even if I actually did not know them?) Mary: Ii. (Yes.) Faye: Aglaan? Maybe before I was born. (But. Maybe before I was born.) Mary: She has heard what she was told before she was born. Faye: My old folks. Ataataakkak imma. Aapaa aŋayuqaak. Tatpauŋaġuumaruklikiimma. Quliaqtuaġmata quliaqtuaġutimanŋa tainna. Tarvaliasi qaurikulukkama, tainna, ullaguumagaat tatpiŋña Avuullaavik. Inilluatauvlugukiuvva iḷitchuġivlugu taimaŋŋaqaŋa iñuich inigisuumagaat. Kisimiḷhiñaq piŋîñmiut, aglaan allattauq iñuich qaisuummiut tatpikuŋa Aviullaaviŋnun tainna aŋuniḷugiaqłutik. Niqiksratik, niqiksraqsiuġuraqłutik piiḷḷiuġnaiñŋuraqtuaq suna ivaqtuaqsimagaat taipkua iñuich. Uvva sumik piqpaaksraitchuŋa aglaan qaurikuluŋmiuŋalukii inna samma, about three or five years old, my mother, aakaga, aullautigaaŋa. Naluruŋa sumuktilaaġa. Sunauvva tatpikuŋa Aviullaaviŋñun. Aŋagagguuq aapaa aniŋaŋa, naŋiliġman. Umiani usiaqsiqouŋa kamiḷḷaqłuŋalu, tainna puuksraaŋnun piraġigaaŋa. Qanuġitilaaŋa uvaŋa uŋasiksilaaŋa naluŋagiga tainna. (My grandparents. My father's parents. They used to go up there all the time too. When they told me about it, it was that way. And then when I became aware of my surroundings they would always go up to Aviullaavik following the same manner. They had discovered it to be a good place to live, when they found it, the people from way back then (Unlimited time.). They were not the only ones, but other people would come up to Aviullaavik to hunt for subsistence. Those people back then looked for places where one did not want for food, where food could be found. I do not want for food, where food could be found. I do not have much to tell, but what I do know is that when I first became aware, about three or five years old, my mother took me somewhere, I do not know where I went. And then I later discovered that it was up to Aviullaavik. They said that we had gone to my uncle. When my father's older brother when he became ill. I rode in the boat, she'd remove my clothing and put me in the sleeping bag. I did not know how it was or how far it was.) Mary: Suqpaniiłłusikiaq aiŋavasi. (I wonder where you were when they came for you.) Faye: Tapqaaluŋmiiłłuta. Kivani. Tapqaaluŋmun uvagut aullaaġuumarugutkii, tatkivaniiłłutauvva aiñiġaik. Sunauvva tarva imma tuqutilaaŋaunnii taamna akkaakaga nalugiga, piiguqtaqpaioouŋakiuvva. Tupiqtuġmaŋniglu iḷisimaŋagaluaġikka tarva piiguqtaġikka. Qanuġlu savaktilaaŋan naluŋagiga. Taapkualuimma sivuani tatpaaniitchuuyuŋnaqsimarut taimma iḷagiiḷḷikiimma, piñiḷuŋnaqtuami iłłutik. Sunapayaaq taipkua iñuich sivulliipsa ivaqtuaqsimagaat inilluataksrakuluk kaaksiunaipayaaq. Ikumallaanakulutuaġlu ivaqtuaqsimagaat. (We were at Tapqaaluk. In the east. We would travel to Tapqaaluk to camp there. While we were staying back there they came for them. And then I discovered that I did not realize the death of my great uncle, because, you see, I kept on forgetting parts of my awareness. I also know when they used a tent, but I keep on forgetting them. I also do not know how they worked. Before them (my family), other people or families, probably relatives, stayed there, since it was a place where one could get by. Our forefathers hunted for everything, including better places to live, where one did not have to go hungry. They also hunted for their lighting, for oil.) Mary: Aasii June-mi aullaqavsi umiakun aullaġuurusi? (And when you left in June, you would leave by boat?) Faye: Ii. (Yes.) Mary: Ii. (Yes.) Faye: June-mi tarva takpaaniiłłutik tagraġaptakii. Aullaġamik September-mi, samma first part of September utiġuurut iḷaanni. August last part utiġuurut. Tatpaani upinġaapak all summer tatpaaniiłłutik. Nanmauvlutik inna. Tagraqtuamik uvva uqaaqtuŋa. Tagraġmata. (They would stay up there in June when we traveled upriver by boat. When they left they would return in the sometimes in the first part of September. They would return in the last part of August. They would stay up there all through the summer. They would backpack in this way. I am talking about traveling upriver by boat. When they traveled upriver by boat. Mary: Tavraasii sumuaglaaqpalliġuuvisi sumunaglaan. (And how far would you travel, to what place?) Faye: Uvva nalupiaġataġiga tamanna Ikpikpak qaurimmiḷuŋalu piŋaioougu. (I really do not know the Ikipikpak because I did not come across it just as I became aware of things.)

ary: Aasi taimani Ataŋaġruuraġluusi piñalu nanmagiaġmaŋnik malikkiviñ sumiñkiaq tavrani piŋavisi? (And in those days back then when Ataŋaġruuraq and someone else went to backpack, did you follow them, where did you do this?) Faye: Kuulugruakkuaqłuta. (We went through Kuulugruaq.) Mary: Kuulugruakuaqłusi? (You went through the Kuulugruaq?) Faye: Ii Kuulugruakuaqłuta. Meade River tagraŋalgitchukta, aasii taima nanmauvlutik, they pack everything on their back. Qimmiḷḷu nanmaliqsuqługich. Two, three or four or five dogs. Aasii tavra tatpauŋa nanmauvlutik qanutun taima siñiktaġaġivat, piiguŋagitka siñiktaġviŋich. Uvlumikii tarva pisuaqsiññaqłutik tainna nuûllaavlutik uvlumi. Nanmakłutik. (Yes. Going through the Kuulugruaq. We traveled upriver through the Meade River, and then they backpacked, they pack everything on their backs. They also put a pack on the dogs. Two, three, or four, or five dogs. And then they traveled backpacking, I do not know how many times they slept over, I have forgotten where they spent the nights. They would walk only in the daytime, moving in the day. Packing things on their backs.) Mary: Umiakuqqaaqłutik? (After they left their boats?) Faye: Umiakuuqqaaqłutik. Umiaqtik unitqaaqługu. Tarva tarvani taapkualu piqatigiikkapta Aqpiksratkut Paamiutkullu imma iñugiaguraqłuta. Colville River tautuŋagiga. I do not know how big I am. Qanutun piisilaaġa nalugigaaglaan malillaruŋa. Malillaruŋa nanmagiaqtakun. (After they stored away their boats. After they left their boat. During the time when we used to travel with Aqpiksraq and Paamiut's families, being quite a few in number. I have seen the Colville River. I do not know how big I am. I don't know how big I was, but I was able to travel with them. I could follow with the ones who went to pack.) Mary: Uvva check-iqtuuraġniaġaagguuq. (They are going to check on the tape.)

Mary: Qanutun utuqqaunasugiviñ taimani? Ten years old qanuk samma. (How old do you think you were in those days? Probably around ten years old.) Faye: Eight or seven samma itchuŋnaptuŋa. (I was probably eight or seven years old.) Mary: Probably eight or seven years old. Bill: What does that mean? (Aŋuyaavik.) Charlie: Aŋuyaaġvik is... uvvakii niġiruat, aŋuyaaqtuat. Niqsaqtamiŋnik. (The ones who were eating, enjoying their hunt. What they had caught.) Mary: Aŋuyaaġvigguuq sumik sivuniqaqpa? (What meaning does Aŋuyaaġvik have?) Faye: Uvva aŋuyaaġnisuurut niġigamik, first. Taamna mikigaluaŋŋaan Niġigammirruŋ alla amma niqiksraqtik itillugu tarvagguuq aŋuyaaqtut. Taamna niqiuraq nuŋłługu niġivḷugu. Aŋuyaaqtuq uvva qanusipayaaq. Different kinds of meat. (They said that they would "aŋuyaaq" when they ate the first catch. Even if what they were eating was small, and food to be had was elsewhere, they were doing what they called "aŋuyaaq". Eating all of what they had caught. They would "aŋuyaaq" any kind of meat.) Charlie: Different kind of game, when they catch it they have their first feast. That is what it means. Bill: It means first feast? Charlie: First catch, I mean. They catch a little someplace else, but when they catch what a whole bunch can eat, they get together and eat together. Bill: You know why they named that place that way? Mary: Iḷisimaviñguuq summan taaptumiŋa..tavra..that is what it means. Faye: Tavra tainna iñuum uqaqtuam qaurigamali tainnaġuurut. Aquanigguuq imma bigger one. Mary: Ii. They have a bigger feast after while, after they get more. Charlie: See, what little they get, they get together with it. Bill: Did that happen every year? Faye: Not often. Mary: Whenever they get to that place, that's when they do it. That's just the way that they do it, whenever they get to that place. So it doesn't have a regular schedule. Bill: That's nice to know. And this is when you were a little girl? Mary: Ii. She was about seven or eight years old. Bill: You had to do a lot of walking, huh? Faye: Yes. But I never carry something. Mary: When we were at Umiat, our granddaughter was only three years old, and she walked all the way to the bluffs way out there from the camp. She was bigger than three years old. She walked back and walked up there, so I think it is just natural for an Eskimo to walk. Tavra tavrani tavruŋaaglaaŋarusi. Aasii ataaqsaqavsi umiavsiññun utiqsaġavsi. Nanmauvlusisuli utiŋavisi umiavsiññun? Faye: Tamarra little bit more, more stuff, skin and meat. Dry meat. They carry it back to their canoe. Charlie: See, they start taking stuff before they even move. They walk long ways and haul all what they catch then they go down there and camp together and start hauling again until they get to their boats. They keep doing that. Faye: They dried the meat and part of it, leave it for afterwards. Charlie: They carry all the skins what they got, for clothing, sinew. Faye: And fat. They leave it for Eskimo ice cream. Bill: Then what happened during the year? Faye: Suna pivauŋ? Mary: Tavraasi tavruŋa utiġavsi ataaqsaġmivḷusi? Faye: Yes. We have to hurry back. Utiqsauraġuurugut not much sleep some times, my parents, not much sleep for the other people. Mary: They keep traveling, sleep very little. Charlie: Them days, freeze up early, but nowadays it's real late. That is quite a change. Bill: Where were you hurrying to? Mary: Where the mouth of the Meade River is, to get out to the... so they can get back to Barrow. Charlie: And also they hurry down to this point here. Aviullaavik. They go down there, and that is where they winter. Mary: That is where they do fall fishing, very good fall fishing in those early days, but right now the channel has changed to the other direction.

Bill: Did your parents camp here or did they go back up to Barrow for the winter? Mary: Aviullaaviŋmurguuq nutqaġuuvisi naakka Utqiaġviŋñun utiqsauraqhusi. Faye: Ukiaqsiġuurut iḷaanni, ilaŋich aasi. Tainnaġuurut tagraqtuatkii. Umiatik sikkutitquŋiññamisigiŋ mauŋautisuugaich. Mary: Whenever they do not want their boats to freeze in up there, they take them all the way to Barrow or to that island. Maġġaq, and... Charlie: There was a lot of houses long time ago at the island. They used to stay up there to camp in the fall time. They hunt, get a lot of polar bears there. Bill: If you did not take your boat back to Barrow then, you leave it? Faye: Yes. Bill: And then would you stay there or go by dog team to Barrow? Faye: In the springtime they go up there and get it, the canoe. And start again in June. Charlie: They haul a lot of meat. Ugruk meat and seal oil up the river so they can use before they start getting what they want. Faye: Whale meat and maktak. Something like that. Mary: And seal oil. Bill: But your parents lived in wintertime in Barrow though? Charlie: No. Mary: Tatkimña kimña suna aullaaġvigisuupiksuaġmiraŋat. Aakan usii aqpanŋuaŋasugauq tatkivani nannum tikiñmasi. Faye: Tapqaaluk. Mary: Ii. Tapqaaluk. What island is that? Charlie: (Unintelligible.) Faye: Tapqaaluŋmiitchuuruaguut uvagut. Mary: That is where they winter most of the time. She hardly had school. She had very little school because they had to travel, on the go all the time for food. It's one of those Plover Islands. Bill: Then in springtime you go back up? Mary: Utqiaġgviŋmullaguugaluaġmiusi, amii. Faye: Sugapta. Mary: Tapqaaluŋmiñ ami. Faye: Ii. Most of the time, Christmas, in the summer...winter... Mary: Upinġaksrami aġviqsiuġiaguuvat? Faye: No. We Stay. Paaŋŋaġuurugut tavra aġviqsiuġnaqsimman. Iŋiḷġaankii Ikpikpakun piŋaitchuŋauvva qaurigama, aglaan Meade Riverkun tarva aġviqsiuġnaqsiq tikitchuuruq. Tikiñmiugullu tatpaaŋŋa tainna. Mary: So they come to Barrow mostly for spring whaling. By June the whaling season is over and that is when they start going up. Faye: Taipkua utaqqiviitchut sumikkiuvva. Mary: They do not waste time. Charlie: The inlet is all full of ice that time in June, and they portage to different creeks and lakes here. They go on up and they hit Meade River and they follow it up. Mary: They either go through Meade or through Ikpikpak. Charlie: See the gas well lake up here is where we get our ice. They portage to that from here, and from there, they take their skin boats and follow the creeks to the lakes and go right into the Meade River. It's all connected up there. Bill: Then would they go over to the Ikpikpuk or stay on? Charlie: No. They go either way they want to go. If they want to go to the Meade River, they come through here. Mary: When she was very, very young, they usually go through Ikpikpak, but as she grows a bit older, they start going through Meade River. About seven or eight years old. One time they were at this island, Tapqaaluk. Faye: In the fall, when the lakes all freeze up to go with dogteam, we go up there, Mary: For trapping and polar bear hunting and seal. While they were up there one time, my grandfather was out hunting and her and my grandmother were alone, and when they saw a polar bear, my grandmother told her to pretend running. Faye: Bear was very close. I try to look up. I was scared. Bill: Why did you start going up the Meade instead of the Ikpikpuk? Why did your parents change and go up the Meade? Mary: Summarguuq Ikpikpakuaqtaŋaiqpat aasii taavuunna, iḷisimaviuŋ taamna? Faye: Naluruŋa. (I do not know.) In the early life my father or their parents they go up by Ikpikpak. That is what they told me. My grandparents on my father's side. But when I get a little older, when I get to know something, we go up by Meade River. I did not know much about the Ikpikpak. Charlie: But there was a lot of people going up the Ikpikpak, too that time. Faye: Yes, yes. Lots of people, any people. Charlie: There was more people going up the Ikpikpak than the Meade River. Bill: When Faye was a little girl? Mary: Even before that, her grandparents. This is what she was saying. Her grandparents were the ones that been traveling up the Ikpikpak River. That is what her dad tells her. They live in that area.

Bill: What was her grandparents' name? Faye: Aapaa atiŋa? (My fathers name?) Mary: Ii. (Yes.) Faye: Aaquatchiaq. My father's father. And his wife, Pimiiḷaq. She was from Point Hope. My grandma. Bill: But your grandfather was from... Faye: I do not know, someplace, old times. Bill: How about your mother's family? Faye: Sunauvva pivauŋ? (What is he referring to?) Bill: Were they from Point Hope? Charlie: Aakaviñ, aakan. (Your mother's, your mother.) Faye: Aakaga maanniittuq.. (My mother was from here.) Mary: No. Faye: My mother? Yes, from here. Mary: Her mother was from Barrow, but her father was raised here in Barrow. He just got married to this girl from Point Hope so, they never live over there. Faye: I was adopted child. I talk about my adopted parents. Mary: In those days, they just give the baby away...no legal.. Faye: My father died long ago. I do not know. Mary: Her real father. Faye: My real father.

Bill: You remember any of the places on the Ikpikpuk River? You remember any of the old places? Faye: Tusaasuugiññaġuŋaġitka...(I think I have merely heard about them.) Mary: Ami tusaasuuratin tamatkua iñuuvigisuuraŋich samma taiḷḷakkupkich ikayuutauniaqtut. (If you just say the names of the places where they used to live, they will be of some help.) Faye: Tatpakkuakii qimiġruaniittuat tatpakkua tusaasuugaluaġitka piigutuvaiḷḷam pigitka. (The ones up by the foothills, those ones. Being so forgetful, I have forgotten them.) Mary: Ii. (Yes.) Taamnalukiuvva Aumaliŋmiit...(And this place also, when you were at Aumalik.) Faye: Ii. Aglaan ukiumilu tainna aapaga tatpauŋaqtuġuunivḷuni uqaġuuruq. Aumaliŋmun, tatpakkunuŋa kuuŋnun. Ukiumi. (Yes. But my father used to say that he used to go up there. To Aumalik, to the rivers. In the winter.) Tainna. (That way.) Tamatkunuŋa kuuŋnun. (To those rivers there.) Sunik qiññaavlutik aŋuraksramiŋnik. (Looking for something to catch.) Sunapayaaq piñauraqtuaq paqinnauraqtuaq tainna qiññaavlugu. (Searching for whatever could be useful where things could be found.) Mary: One time when Charlie and the boys were putting a net in the lake where we were getting our water from. And she was walking around that area, and found an old pan not to far from the river. Very close to the lake, and she never knew it, the house and she... Charlie: Been a house there, and we found some sod and came right around where the house was built. Mary: And there was old can and some rope.. Bill: I think you mentioned that place once. Charlie: That is right. It is right there. Bill: What did you call it again? Charlie: We do not know the name for it. Faye: Atiqaġaluaŋaruq kiimma naluvlugu. (It probably had a name before, but we do not know it.) Mary: Aa. Tavra. (Yes.) Charlie: (Unintelligible.) It's right...Iqaluaqpalik. That is a little lake right there. You got it. I do not know what the name is. It just goes right there, goes right out there Chipp Two. Bill: Okay. That is close enough for us. Charlie: That little lake is right here. It is right on the edge of that old house. Mary: When we were traveling through Qaksraugaġvik one of the boys was going to go after caribou, and that was when we just landed by the river, and we saw where there has been a cabin too. At Qaksraugaġvik.

Bill: You remember any of the winter feasts or festivals on the Ikpikpuk, any messenger feasts? Mary: Ikpikpaŋmiguuq taimani uvva aqpatat uvvauma sut uvvauma pivagi. Messenger...What do you mean? Bill: People send out messengers to other camps, and they come together for celebration in wintertime? Charlie: Aqpataqayiutchuŋnaqtuq takpaani takpaaŋŋamiñ. (There probably were no runners up there, from up there.) Mary: Aqpataqayiurchuŋnaqtuq ami tatpaani kuuŋmi. (There probably were no runners up there, on the river.) Charlie: That's what they have on through the coastline. From the Point, Barrow, Wainwright and all them areas. That is where they have...not up inland. Faye: Yes. They are at same place. I do not know. Charlie: I have not heard of any inland. Faye: But I heard that they had made a corral for caribou. That was the only thing I heard. Bill: Where was that? Faye: I do not know where they...I can't say. Charlie: I think that.. is up the Kamis, Kummis, that corral up into a lake. Kaŋiñi. They call it the Kaŋi. Mary: Kaŋiġaqruqługit Kaŋiġaliuqługit. (Corralling them, making a corral for them.) Faye: Innakii Kaŋiġaġnaġumiñaqtuaq nuna, nunaqaġman Kaŋiġaġnaġumiñaqtuamik imaqaqtuniḷu isiqtinniuraaqługich. (This way, whenever there was a place where it was possible to corral, when there was land on which it was possible to corral that also had water, they would try to get them to enter it.)

Bill: Did you ever remember your parents ever telling you stories about this river? About things that happened there? Mary: Itqaumaviñguuq quliaqtuavaġimmaŋnik aŋayuqaakkiñ qanuq pisuutilaaŋiññik taipkua? Ikpikpaŋmi. Faye: Uvva uvvatualuk una. Aullaġuuruarguuq tarva niġiññaviksramiŋñun. Niġiñiḷugvigiksramiŋnun. Tarvatualuk sumulliqaa aullaġuurut iñuich niġiḷḷaaviksramiŋnun susuŋniksraviksramiŋnun. Tarvatualuk. Taamnauvva iḷisimatualukkiga. Mary: She only could tell you. Faye: Ivaġaatkii sunapayaaq niqiksraq. Mary: Qanuq uvauna uqautiginiaqpigu. (How shall I talk about this?) Charlie: They're traveling so...they're traveling for food. Mary: For survival. Charlie: For survival. Any place they go, it was just for survival, where they can survive. They don't know what they are going to run into, but they keep going in, even though they were real low on food. And that's what that name was in there, that's when people like that was traveling, and they finally got some game, and they call it Aŋuyaaġvik. Faye: That is the only thing I know. Bill: I was wondering if she'd remember that story of the battle. That battle place. Charlie: I do not think so. That is east of there. That's...Taapkua tusaaŋaitkisiñ Itqiḷit iñuktuqtuat Iñupianik kuupałłuum pani? (Have you heard of the Indians who murdered some Iñupiaq by the (lit. bad) river?) Faye: Atchu. Naluruŋa, piigutuvluŋakiuvva uvvauvaŋa piuŋa. Nalugitka. (I do not know. I am forgetful, perhaps I forgot. I do not know them.) Charlie: The only ones that will remember would be Tasiqpak people. That was the guys that were up around that area. From Tasiqpak Lake, that goes up. They go up that..I guess Arnold mentioned that river where you go up. He's got some of them marked. Bill: On the Meade River. When you started going up the Meade River. What are some of the places you remember on the Meade River? Mary: Aasigguuq tamattumuunna. Sunausii pamna? (What was that up there?) Kuulugruaq. Kuulugruamigguuq atqit tamatkua sut uvva iḷisimanasugiḷugich. (He thought maybe you knew the names of some of the places on the Kuulugruaq River.) Faye: Iḷisimakulukkitka iḷaŋit. Nallaullugich piñiaŋitkaluaġugnaġitka. (I fortunately remember some of them. Perhaps I might not get them all right.) Mary: Ii. Uvva tamatkua ukiumi naakka upinġaami nutqaġviusuuvat, uvva tainnatchimik kaŋiqsiuqtuq, amii. Faye: Tatpikaami Tikiġluk. Nalunaitchuq kisimi. (There is Tikiġluk. It is the only one which is for sure.)

Bill: In wintertime were you still living in Barrow? Or were you living out on the Meade River? Faye: Not in the summer. Just in the summer, we go up... Bill: Just go up in summertime? Faye: Yes. Mary: She said from June to September. Faye: We stay here just in the spring. Not all winter. Just in the spring and in the fall. Charlie: They go to that island. Mary: Right after the lakes are freezing, they go to the island. Tapqaaluk Island. Sometimes they go up the river during the winter. Like to that Aumalik. Charlie: Aumalik. That is a bluff. That is Simiutaq, Simiutaq Bluff. Bill: That's on the Ikpikpuk? Charlie: Yes. (Section missing.) Bill: So you'd go up the Meade and then cut over to Aumalik? Charlie: You can do that. It's not very far, but they don't do that. They stay on the river where there's wood, where there's willows what they can burn. That's the main sources there for wood, and burning material for food, and heat. Bill: What are the places along the Meade River where she had fish camp, where she stopped and fished? Mary: Aasii suqpani iqalliqisuuvat, taamnaunauvva suna Tikiġluk sumik taisuuvarruŋ. Charlie: Tikiġluk. Atqasuk aasi takanna salliuraŋa. Mary: Tikiġluk. That's on the Meade River where they do their fishing. Bill: Near Atqasuk. Coal mine area. Charlie: And also at Utik's place. Itqiḷiq. Piqsaġniq. Mary: Wherever the fish is there, that's where they go, not just anywhere, but wherever they can find fish. Charlie: What I was telling you. You do not have to go to the same place every year. Once you find a place where it's deep, that's a good place. Bill: I was just interested in the names of those places. Charlie: See the best man to.. if you want the names of the Meade River go see Walter, Utik. (Akpik). Bill: We'll see him. But when you go upriver from Tikiġluk what place is up there? Charlie: There's places up there. Faye: Sunauvva pivauŋ. (What is he referring to.) Charlie: Tikiġluŋmiñguuq aullagavsi atiŋi uvva nunat iḷisimasukługit. Faye: Mattumatchium? Uvva Itqiuraq kisian iḷisimagaluaġiga. Aluaqaqtuaq. Piiguŋaitkaluaġugnaġiga taamna. Kaŋŋirviglu Kaŋŋirvigisuuraqput. (This side? I only remember Itqiuraq which has coal, and Kaŋŋirvik, which used to be as far as we'd go. That's where we left our canoe and start out with packing our back. The people. They had a hard time, those people back then. Bill: Where did they pack to? Charlie: They pack into....sometimes right into the Noatak. Mary: Right into Colville...wherever. Charlie: They just keep going until they find game. Bill: And you leave your boat at that place, Kaŋŋirvik? Does that have a special meaning, that name? Charlie: That's the end. End. That's a dead end. That's the meaning. Faye: I do not know how many canoes they left. Three or five canoes. Wendy: How did they leave their canoes, on the ground or... Charlie: No. They have racks...qakutaqaqtut, ai, umianun pikani. Qakutchiqougit qimaguuvatigich? (Did they have racks for boats up there, did they not? Did they leave them on the racks?) Faye: Pałułługich pałułługich aasi suġuattat piksuġiŋiññun tamauŋa iḷiuqqaqługich tamanna aŋmaiyaqugu avataat willows-nik. (Turning them upside down and putting some belongings on the seats (inside the boat), and sealing up the edge of the boat with willows.) Mary: They put some of their stuff inside the boat, put them on top of the seats. Faye: Squirrel is always "pakak" (dig around), even the mouse. Charlie: I've been up that river too, not too much. Bill: You know that place she's talking about? Charlie: I've been up there with plane. Hunting wolves. Bill: Lots of fishing places on that Meade River. Charlie: Yes. Faye: Iqaluutukkii. (There is a lot of fish in there.) But they keep on going to the end of the...where they can end. Bill: You had to go a long way for the caribou then, huh? Mary: Iglauqpaguumarusigguuq tuttunniuraġavsi. Faye: Yes. They had a hard time. You know the river is always like that sometimes...They got no water in the summer, that river. They just try to haul their canoe, push it, and pull it. Mary: Sometimes when the river is too winding my grandma, she used to tell us, my grandmother would just go that way and cook the meal right there while they're trying to get around the bend. Wendy: How did they get the boat up the river? Charlie: They pulled it with rope. And dogs.

Bill: That place they call Pulayaaq and Payuuvik (Payugvik). Lots of houses up there. Mary: After my grandfather got old, he can't go any further than Pulayaaq. That's when his last fishing days was there. Pulayaaq. 'Cause he was too old to go to Aviullaavik. Faye: Right there was when my grandmother and him was still living, Aviullaavik, and when he was single, at Pulayaaq. Charlie: I remember him at Aviullaavik. He used to come up there with...Long as you have a lot of nets...Lots of people go up there from Barrow and from Cape Simpson. They fish there. Fall fishing. Bill: Then there's that place...(Isuqtum Paaŋa (mispronounced) Qaviarat.) Charlie: Qaviarat. Mary: Qaviarat. Charlie: Isuqtuq, Qaviarat, that little stretch there, they got other names. Mary: That's where Barrow people fish, go fishing in the falltime. Charlie: Siñiktaġnaiḷaq. (lit. place where one cannot sleep overnight.) Bill: Uqpiksuu. Charlie: Uqpiksuu. Mary: School have a summer camp up there for the kids at Uqpiksuu. Charlie: I haven't fished out of Meade River myself at all. The only river I know is Ikpikpak.

Bill: Maybe I could ask you one or two more questions. Do you remember your parents telling you who the Ikpikpagmiut people were? Mary: Iḷisimaviñguuq aŋayuqaagpiñ uqautiŋammatin Ikpikpaŋmiunik iñuŋnik kiutilaaŋiññik? Faye: Nunataaġmiuliqisuurut aglaankii tarva. Tainna. Taiyumiñaitkitkaaglaan. (They used to talk about the people of the land, but I cannot say their names.) Mary: Aglaan amii tatpaani tainna iñuulġatayuitchut tainna kukiḷukpaiḷḷutik, they're like nomads. (But isn't it true that they did not live that way up there because they traveled around so much.) Faye: They move to different places, when they found it, good place to live, they move up. Charlie: They just go back and forth. They go to Noatak and back, and all over, and go east and back, they never stop. Faye: When it's time to hunt. Bill: Were there diseases or epidemics that hurt those people? Faye: Piruanik uvva naŋittuanik piŋaitchuŋa tainna aglaan tavra aŋaga taamna arriqivḷuni aaka aimmagu iḷisimauraŋagiga. Tarvatualuk. (Section missing.) Mary: She's never known of an epidemic. They did have a measles when she was just a baby in Barrow. Charlie: They always say that in the old days there was no epidemics around of any kind. They were all healthy people. But when the white men start coming the epidemics started, and that cut the Natives down to quite a bit. Faye: Tavraniuvva measle-paŋmata taimani Piġniġmiinŋamarugut. Mary: The first measles that ever occurred when she was just a baby about three years old. They were at Piġniq that time. Faye: Imaġluuvva tautukkapku aapaa tupiġmi. Tarva iḷitchuġilivaruŋa. Tupiġmun isiqsimauruaq, sunauvva imma unaŋŋa. Mary: She only knew they already have the stuff out from the tent and pack it where it's higher and water just came into the tupiq (tent), in the tent. Charlie: They had a big storm. Faye: Aakaalu imaniqsiuġutimmaŋa iḷisimagalualgitchuŋa tainna sutilaamnik nalusuummivḷuŋalu. (Section missing.) Mary: Her mother was carrying her on her back, and she notices that the sandbar was very smooth. You know how it is after a big storm? She noticed that. Faye: But I do not know where we...back to Barrow or somewhere. Mary: They were looking for... Charlie: They were picking clams. Faye: Quliaqtuaksraiġugnaqtuŋa tavra? (I probably have no more to talk about.) Bill: Gee, you lived a good life, huh?

Wendy: I was just wondering. You were talking earlier about people taking seal meat and seal oil and maktak up the rivers, and kind of caching it. How did they do that? How did they leave it? Charlie: They preserve it. They put it in oil in seal pokes, and it don't spoil. That's how we preserve meat, too, even whale meat. It gets real bitter and real good, but you just keep it covered where it's cool. Wendy: So you kept it in a cellar or something? Charlie: No, they dig a hole in the ground. They call it "agraġniq". They put it in there, dig right down to the frost, and they keep it in there, and it never spoil. Faye: And a little willow underneath. Charlie: And also that's how they preserve fish when they catch a lot of fish, they dig in the ground and put willows underneath and the sides, and put the fish in there and let it ferment. That's what I was telling you that I found that was weaved. They've been up there lots of times. Faye: Ataaqłutiglu pisuunisuugaluaqtut tainna. Tamauna piqqaqłutik. Taipkua. (They also say they'd often go downriver. After going that way. Those people long ago). Charlie: And this old man stays up there in the wintertime he stays up there and digs them on the snow banks, digs holes on the snowbanks so he can get enough caribou meat for his crew in the springtime. So he digs and all the caribou he gets he puts it in a sled. He put mud runners, ice runners on his sled, wide, and load that sled up maybe twenty caribou or so like that. I don't see how they can pull that, but they said he just have one dog. He helped his dog. And he takes it clear to Barrow. I do not know his name though. Faye: They said he got a big load, caribou and some other stuff. Charlie: Tan the skins and all. He saves them and takes them up to Barrow, and he goes whale hunting. Bill: You remember that man's name? Faye: I do not see them, but I hear them. They cover their sled with ice underneath. Charlie: Then when he's going to camp, they said he put some wood under ice or wood under his sled so it won't frost. And when he's ready to go he takes it off and wiggles his sled..., his got a big willow bar in front to move his sled, and that way when he traveled, they say sometimes he travels not very far in one day. He finally gets to Barrow. One dog. Faye: They try to save any kind of meat what they catch. They crush the bone and cook them, boil them, and take out the fat and let it freeze. And save it for when they get home. They never throw out the bone. They just have to crush it and cook it again. That's what the old timers do, but not now. Charlie: You know what I was telling you about the Ningeoks, that's the last ones that I've seen that does that, old man Ningeok and his wife. When we were herding reindeer, they'd pick all our bones what the dogs didn't eat. They'd crush them and get all the fat out of the bones. They use ptarmigan for meat to mix in their akutuq (ice cream), and he'd come over and bring us some akutuq. From them bones we throw away! Faye: The broth is real good after they boil it, the bone. The broth is real good. Wendy: Charlie, you were talking about trapping caribou by digging a hole. Charlie: Yes. They call it "kataktuġvik," amii. (Place where they fall.) Faye: Saa? Charlie: Tuttut kataktuġiqtuqługit pisuugaich taimani. (They caught caribou this way in those days.) Faye: Qargisaq. They make a big hole enough for caribou. I do not know how tall, that caribou can't get out, and they cover it with snow again and qumignik, (their urine), to smell when the wind is this way they put this way. And the caribou get in and trap. They can't get out. They see part of it this way, I guess. The back. Wendy: So it would be about maybe four feet deep? Charlie: Four feet deep. Wendy: Maybe you could draw a picture to give us a better idea. Charlie: So they snare them in the willows.

Bill: When was the last time you were up on the Meade River? Faye: Oh..with those guys. When I get old. Bill: You still go up the Ikpikpuk? Faye: No I did not go by Ikpikpak much when I was young. Just the only thing I said about the Meade River. Charlie: We take her up the Ikpikpak with boat. Faye: When I get old I go up with my son-in-law. I know what my father said about Aviullaavik. I always go over there, but I do not know much. The other end. Just Aviullaavik. But when I get older, I know a little more. We just go up by Meade River, when I get a little older. Wendy: Do you have a favorite place on the Ikpikpuk? Charlie: It's on the Meade River. She goes to the Meade River. She goes fishing by herself, up on the Meade River. Bill: What place does she like up there? Charlie: Suqpaniitchuuviñ? Maani Kuulugruami pigavich. Qaviaranun? Naagga... Faye: Aullaġama? Ii, Qaviarani. Charlie: Qaviarat. That's where she fishes. Faye: I used to stay up there when I just (unintelligible). I like fishing. Wendy: What we talked about the other day. There was one place that you talked about as the high bluffs that had a snow overhang. Charlie: Okay. They call it Aimaniq. That's where Tom Brower, Jr's cabin is. On the end of it. That one there always has a big snow bank when the river first breaks. They all say, stay away from the snow banks. I heard of one boat going up. They told them that, but they didn't mind. They found out what was wrong. Bill: Was that a long time ago, then? Charlie: Yes. Long time ago, yes. They were covered. Well, when it falls, it's like a tidal wave when it comes. And when even the bank falls from the Ikpikpak, it cuts up maybe four or five feet high, it pushes up the water, from the drop. That's a lot of it that goes along the Ikpikpak. Them days, long time ago I guess the river wasn't too wide. Just a big sand bar now.

Wendy: Kiñaviaq mean anything to you? It's a name I've heard from along the coast someplace. Charlie: Kiñaviaq? That's the only name...that's Hilda Kiñaviaq. Wendy: That's a person's name? Charlie: Yes. A person's name. Wendy: Do you know where her family would have camped? Charlie: She's at Point Hope, huh? Hilda Kiñaviaq. Mary: Hilda Weber. Bill: Amaġuaq's family and grandson in a place along the coast here. What do you call this place where Amaġuaq had a cabin?