Project Jukebox

Digital Branch of the University of Alaska Fairbanks Oral History Program
Evelyn Mike

Evelyn Mike was interviewed on August 11, 1997 by Judith Morris at Lakecrest Bed and Breakfast in Kokhanok, Alaska. In this interview, Evelyn talks about her childhood in Kokhanok, going to school there, and who lived in the community. She also talks about learning traditional subsistence skills and beliefs, helping her father on the trapline, and collecting berries and plants and preparing food. She also discusses land use issues related to hunting lodges using Native owned private property, changes in transportation and access, and changes in the climate effecting subsistence activities. Finally, Evelyn mentions changes she has seen in the village, the importance of education, and the preservation of her subsistence way of life.

Digital Asset Information

Archive #: Oral History 1998-21-08

Project: Katmai National Park
Date of Interview: Aug 11, 1997
Narrator(s): Evelyn Mike
Interviewer(s): Judith Morris
Location of Interview:
Funding Partners:
National Park Service
Alternate Transcripts
There is no alternate transcript for this interview.
Slideshow
There is no slideshow for this person.

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Sections

Her personal and family background

Her family heritage and people who lived in Kokhanok when she was a girl

Continuation of people who lived in Kokhanok, and first going to school when she was a girl

Her early memories of school and teachers, and how her father trapped and worked to support the family

Traveling with and learning subsistence activities from her father

Her father using booties on his dog team, and how wood was steamed for a dog sled frame

The types of fur clothes and boots they used to wear when she was a girl

Gender based food restrictions, especially with salmon heads

The proper way to treat animals when they have been killed, and how her mother used to prepare and store berries

Storing berries, preparing fish, and going to Fall fish camp

Traveling by boat in the area, and effects of sport fishermen coming to Kokhanok

The effects of sport fishermen in Kokhanok and their use of private property

Getting proper compensation from lodges using private property, and the effects of sport fishermen in the Kokhanok area

Her mother getting money from lodges for use of her land, her brothers hunting, and people camping at Amakdedori

Being taught to gather food when it is in season, not to be lazy, and hunting ptarmigan and rabbits

Learning how to set snares from her mother and sisters

Her mother's and father's trapping activities

Gathering eggs in the spring

Using plants as food and medicine

Living in a house down on the beach and hauling water

Going ice fishing in the Spring

Changes in the timing of freeze up and its effects on travel

Going berry picking near Kokhanok, and the importance of respecting old gravesites

Old graves around the village and the death and burial of Mike Newyaka

The funeral and burial of Mike Newyaka, and her memories of the death of a baby in the village

Changes she has seen in her lifetime and which she thinks has had the greatest effect on life in Kokhanok

Changes in village life continued

Her and her brothers' education away from Kokhanok, and the pros and cons of village high schools

The future of her children's education in trade school or college

The importance of her subsistence way of life

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Transcript

MS. JUDITH MORRIS: This is August 12th -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: 11. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: August 11th, excuse me. It's Monday morning. We're in Kokhanok, Alaska, in Lakecrest Bed and Breakfast. I'm here with Evelyn Mike. This is Judith Morris. Evelyn, you've been -- were you born and raised in Kokhanok, or where were you born? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, I was born here. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Actually born here? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Or were you born in Anchorage? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No, I wasn't born in Anchorage. I -- I think my godmother, she's deceased now, she delivered me. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: And her stories are quite interesting because she said I don't know how many times she lost my pulse. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: As a baby? MS. EVELYN MIKE: As a baby. Being born. And I don't know if it was right after I was born or how many days after, and my mom said I was taken out on a helicopter. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Where -- do you know where the helicopter came from? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I have no idea. How long I stayed at the hospital, I don't know. I haven't asked my mom. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: This was Anchorage or Kanakanak? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Probably Anchorage. And somewhere, I think it was coming back, maybe my dad picked me up in Anchorage or -- and took me to Iliamna to bring me home, but Marlene Nielsen's mom, Annie Parks, she would often talk about having twins because I think my dad got stuck in Iliamna. I'm not really sure, but, you know, she just said I had twins. And she was taking care of Marlene and she was taking care of me. But -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So you and Marlene are about the same age? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, about the same age. Maybe a month. Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Who are your parents? MS. EVELYN MIKE: My parents are Gregory and Katherine Mike. My mother's maiden name, I don't know how to even say it, but I could spell it. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Yeah, spell it. MS. EVELYN MIKE: K-L-O-D-I-A-S-T-I-E. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: I've never heard of that. MS. EVELYN MIKE: I've never heard of it. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Where was she from originally? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Newhalen, I believe. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And your dad? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Here. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Here? MS. EVELYN MIKE: And he's always talking about my Grampa Johnny and my Grandma Evelyn living in Kokhanok, and that's where he was born. Exact site, I don't know. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: I've heard the Mikes have been in the village a long time, in Kokhanok a long time. Do you know where they were from originally? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, I don't know. I heard a lot of Mikes up in the Kuskokwim area. Whether or not that's where my Grampa Johnny came from, I don't know.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: And then my dad mentioned something about my grampa saying that he had some Blackfeet blood in him. Blackfeet. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Like from Montana? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Blackfeet Indian. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: How that -- how that happened, I don't know. Quite interesting. But I guess my grandma and them were the -- one of the first to settle here because my dad said he was born here. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uncle Pete, my godmother. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: How old is your dad? MS. EVELYN MIKE: He turned 73 in June. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So he was born here -- this is 1997. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So he was born here in 1924. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. He was born, he says 1924, and his baptismal records, out of Juneau -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: -- it says it's 1929. And they are conflicting dates because his sister, the one that died, Elaina Ricteroff, she was born in 1929. And my cousin Marina said I saw my mom's birth certificate and it -- she said I don't know what month, what day, she said 1929. And so I guess since it was written, they are going by the written, you know, by the written record because there's no way that my dad could prove to the state that he was born in 1924 because their house burned down, and everything in it. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Wow. When was that? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Gosh. I don't know. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: How many brothers and sisters do you have? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I have three brothers and two sisters. The sisters, they have a different father who died when they were small. And the only father they ever knew was my dad. But I'm my dad's only surviving daughter. He had two before -- before I came around and I guess from mom, and they lost them. And mom says, counting all the ones that died and the miscarriages, maybe 12 or 13. And there's just like half of us that are living. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Wow. When you were -- I don't know how -- I don't know how old you are, you're in your thirties? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I'm 35. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: 35? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So when you were young in Kokhanok, who was living in the village? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, my mom and my dad. My Uncle Joe and his family. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Joe Wassillie? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. Is that Little Joe? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Gregory? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Elia Ignaty, you know, he's dead now. His brother, Nick Ignaty. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Where did the Ignatys come from, do you know? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. Okalena (phonetic) Ignaty, though, her father was --

MS. EVELYN MIKE: -- Pete Mike who was my Grampa Johnny's brother. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: And I remember Nick G. Olympic. He was my Sunday school teacher, but he died when I was small. You know, I can't even remember how old. And up until I was 9 years old, there's this old man we all called Aapa, Mike Newyaka, Mary -- Mary Newyaka's husband. He died when I was like 9. And I still talk about him every day like he's still living. And Fennie Andrew. His wife and his family. Gregory Andrew. John Nielsen. I don't know what year Danny Roehl came. I think it was when I was in high school, when I was 16, 15, somewhere around there. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: My godparents, William and Elaina Ricteroff. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Was William the one they called Willie? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. And did I mention Elia Ignaty? I'm trying to get everybody up on the road. Mary Nelson. Her and her boys. I think that's all. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: That's all? When -- when you were a young girl, then -- so this would have been in the mid -- well, you were born in the mid '60s? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I was in 1961. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: 1961. When you were born, there was already a school in the village? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, I think so, because where Johnny and Shirley's old house is, that used to be a school, I understand. And my mom and them have some pictures there. And the house Gregory Andrew lives in, I remember Miss Smith, she came in and taught. I don't remember, like, going to school with them. I think the first teacher I ever remembered was -- what was his name? He used to throw me up in the air and catch me. Mr. Brandon. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Oh. MS. EVELYN MIKE: I can't remember his first name, but I remember his wife, her name was Willina, and they had two kids, Ricky and Debbie. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Was it a one-room schoolhouse when you started? MS. EVELYN MIKE: It's kind of hard to say. I just remember when I first started, I just remember going into the apartment with Molly, Jackie, Matrona.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: The kids. And I was one we would go into the apartment and Mrs. Brandon would do some things with us. I remember Mr. Potato Head. But I think it was one room. And then I don't know what grade I was, they put that partition on. And that was when Mr. and Mrs. Hooley came. How they fit us all in there is beyond me. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Okay. Let's back up a minute. Before you went to school, was your dad, was he a trapper and a commercial fisherman or how did he support the family? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I remember him trapping, driving dogs all the time. I remember him having to leave for Naknek. How I remember is because I used to get so lonely for him. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: He would go down in the springtime? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. But I remember also, too, that he would work at the school. And it was under the Alaska state operated school system. And I would ask him, you know, just out of curiosity, what the pay scale was, he said $30 -- $30 a month. And I think it averaged out to one dollar a day. And I thought, golly, what -- he's dedicated or he's just -- you know, that was the only job that was around. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: There weren't so many jobs? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. And that's how -- that's all I remember him doing. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So you don't remember as a young girl in the '60s that he was going out and trapping and gone for a week or two at the time, or? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. I think maybe when I -- when I was about maybe six or seven or somewhere in there, I remember him home during the winter. And I think it had something to do with the school year. Because I was looking at those -- excuse me -- those old paycheck stubs that he used to have. I should have kept them. One was dated, I think, 1961 or 1962. What that was for, I don't know, but he got a plaque. And when he retired, he had like 26 years. And... MS. JUDITH MORRIS: When did he retire? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I can't tell you the exact date. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: But I guess he -- he enjoyed it. The first year he retired I think was the first year he bought his new, you know, those three-wheelers, the kind that you see Sheila Nelson running around in. Him and mom went fishing or went out every day, trapping, fishing, berry picking. I don't know how many miles they put on that three-wheeler. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: By then you didn't have your dogs? MS. EVELYN MIKE: We still have our dogs but they are just for pets. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So you don't have a team anymore? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. In fact, right now, I have -- I have like six dogs penned up because...

MS. EVELYN MIKE: ...my mom always let -- well, our younger kids, like our youngest one is four, that's my niece's girl, and her boy is six and my nephew is seven, you know, for those guys to have puppies because they like to -- they like to play with them. You know, they are good live toys or something. And it just never felt right at a fish camp to have no dogs, I think. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do you ever remember using the dog team or being taken anywhere with the dog team? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. I was my daddy's tail. I don't know he put up with me. I remember getting wood with him. And I -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Where would you go to get wood? How far out would you have to go? Just around the village or -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: I don't know where -- we have so much trees here. I don't know where he went. Seems like he always went and we were always in the trees. And I remember one year -- I know I'm straying off the subject, but let me tell you something. The first time I ever went out with my dad when he caught a moose, I kept thinking, what do you mean by moose, dad? That was with a dog team, I think. December maybe? I'm not too sure, though. And I would ask him, dad, where did you caught that moose? Over the hill. It might be this hill back behind the airport. And I said, where do you catch the moose from? On top of the trees? Probably because I was asking too much dumb questions, and he said, yeah. And so I remember looking up at the trees. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: The top of the trees. MS. EVELYN MIKE: The tops of the trees to see if I could see tons of meat. But we always had dogs. We used them to get wood. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did your mom drive the team, too? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. One day her and Mary went out to get wood. I don't know where my dad was, maybe he was sick. She had come home with whole bunch of wood and there was only two or three dogs. Must have been tough to pull the load. But I remember him going to the store when Art Lee had it in Iliamna, he would go over there with his dogs. And we couldn't wait for him to come back because he would have some -- have something for us. And I remember very clearly those little -- little felt cowboy hats. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Oh, that he would bring back with him? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, he would bring back something. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did they used to put like booties or anything on the dogs' feet? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. I remember we would make them out of thick green canvas, or maybe it was tarp. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-huh. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. I don't remember. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: (Inaudible.) MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: We would put them on, I think. I didn't see them too much when it's -- when there's lots of snow. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: But I'd see them like right before breakup, you know, when the ice gets really sharp. Because I think they used their dogs as long as there was ice. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-huh. MS. EVELYN MIKE: And I remember him putting those booties on there. And I kept thinking, how come the dogs are going to have to wear socks. And he told me, he says, so their -- the bottoms of their feet won't get cut up. And I remember I did see one of the dogs with like a cut. I don't know what he put on it, but after he put something on it, then he took the boot off and tied it up -- tied them up. And he used to sit and sew those booties. I don't know how many pairs he made. I remember him doing that. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did you ever see your dad make a sled or do you ever remember anything about having to get new sleds or? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Seemed like as long as I could remember him, he hauled -- he always had a sled. But there was this -- I don't know, this contraption. It was bent. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Wood? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. I think it was made out of birch. And I used to wonder how they did -- did they get trees just like that, you know, bent, or did they have to bend them. And I remember somebody making a sled, you know, I just remember the runner part. It might have been him, I'm not sure, though. I remember -- I don't know if it was a camp stove or if it was a stude (phonetic) stove. It had a -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What's a stude stove? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, it's those dinky little stoves they had before the camp stoves came in, like a brass -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Oh. Yeah. MS. EVELYN MIKE: -- fuel thing. And it stood up like maybe six, maybe six inches. Or maybe it was a camp stove. And I think they had water boiling. And I think it was in those square -- square cans that Blazo or kerosene used to come in. And I think they had them boiling in that because I was wondering, what are they going to cook. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And so it was the wood that was boiling? MS. EVELYN MIKE: They put that -- I think they put that frame right over it somehow. And the steam just -- and they did something, put the wood in there or how they got the wood in there or maybe they slowly bent it in there, but I was just wondering, what are they cooking. And I remember seeing that process once. And maybe it was my Uncle Joe. I can't remember. But I remember somebody putting up those -- I don't know what those things you call that, stand up -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: On the sled? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Yeah, the sides of the sled. MS. EVELYN MIKE: I remember somebody putting those up there.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: I don't remember the flaps. Those are the only things I remember. I was busy playing, I guess. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did you have when you were a young girl, the clothes that you wore when it was cold, were they made out of furs or? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Mukluks. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Mukluks? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I remember mukluks, but I didn't like mukluks. Oh, they were the slipperiest things I can -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did your mom make those mukluks, or? MS. EVELYN MIKE: My sister made them for me. I wish they could have used that -- I don't know what kind of thing they used, but I remember my dad buying a pair of soles. Nice looking boots, but God, I hated those soles because I would slip down. I don't know how many bruises I had. And I liked Moses' pair because they were soft. He didn't slip. He didn't slip down. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: I wonder what they used on the soles. MS. EVELYN MIKE: I don't know, but I was wishing mom or Mary, the ones they made me, would work like that. And I remember slipping and everything, saying no matter how pretty mukluks are, I don't think I'm going to wear them again. Even if I had any children, I wouldn't make them wear them. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What about parkas? Did you wear a parka or hats or gloves or anything made out of furs? MS. EVELYN MIKE: The guys who did travelling, they had fur, I guess, fur hats, fur, fur-lined mittens. But no, mine were just basically store bought. We have one parka, mom said all of us kids used it from my brother Nick, down -- Nick, my brother Johnny, then I wore it. And I remember my brother wearing it. And how I used to tease him, my brother Moses, I said, dogs are going to get you. And he wouldn't want to put it on. I can't remember who made that parka for my brother. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Was this a squirrel parka? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, squirrel parka with, I think, maybe wolverine trim and some red yarn. And I remember there was white, maybe there was weasel in it. We have a picture of Sasha in it when she was maybe like one, two. We have that parka but I don't know what happened to it. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did your mother ever trap? Do you remember your mom trapping? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Every spring I know she went and did -- went and trapped squirrels. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did she, like, around the village or would she leave the village to go trap the squirrels? MS. EVELYN MIKE: When I was small we moved up to where our current location is at our fish camp. And I remember in the hills back there, you know, back behind. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: In back? MS. EVELYN MIKE: In back of fish camp, that's where she would go trap for them. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What was she trapping squirrels for? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I guess it was springtime was the best time eating them she said. But she would never let us eat any. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Who would eat them? MS. EVELYN MIKE: She said only old people.

MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Saving the best, huh? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Probably. She always said the bears were going to get us or something like that. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. Uh-hum. Did you -- do you ever remember eating bear when you were younger or now, or? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. And I remember my mom and them would eat the -- the feet, but they said we couldn't eat them. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: I wonder, you don't remember why you had certain food restrictions? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No, I don't remember why. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. Were there any food restrictions you had as a girl that your brothers didn't have? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. You know, the salmon heads. Girls are only allowed to eat them until they start to turn red. And I asked my mom why, and she said, well, the boys are the hunters and she said that's the favorite part, I think, where it's the head part, the bears had always went after. And I think that's why. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And so like eating the same food as the bears gave the boys like strength like bears? MS. EVELYN MIKE: They couldn't eat heads right away. They had to wait until maybe end of June or first of July, somewhere along there. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: The boys? MS. EVELYN MIKE: The boys. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And the girls could never eat them? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Girls, we got -- we got lucky and ate them. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Oh, you -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. And then I remember my mom, my mom was the same way, because her last child was a boy, she couldn't eat the heads. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: She still can't eat the heads? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Usually I claim them first because we don't get a whole bunch like, you know, just one, two, sometimes two. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: These are king heads? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. Reds. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Oh, reds? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Up until maybe sometime after the 4th of July, then you start getting some. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And then once a bunch come in, can everybody eat them? Or the boys still can't eat them? MS. EVELYN MIKE: They make the boys wait a while. I never really remember how long. Usually -- I don't know -- I don't know how long boys waited. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What about today? Do they still do that with the boys? Are your nephews that way? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Mom's still like that with the boys. She's still like that with all the boys. And there was something else I was going to point out, but I can't remember what it was. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Yeah, we were talking about food and girls or boys -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: I never knew why, too, the first salmon she used to get some charcoal, wood charcoal from the stove, get it -- cool it off and everybody would take a little piece. Why, I don't know.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: And I often wondered, how come you did that? She says, well, when I was small, I never asked them why. One day she said, I wasn't nosey like you guys, I guess. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What about when your brothers got their first animals, you know, caught their first animal -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- did your parents have them do anything special? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I know they give it away. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And just anybody in the village gave it away -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did they let them eat it at all, do you remember? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I think they ate it. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did they ever tell you stories about the different animals about, you know, some animals that were maybe more powerful or -- or special or that you needed to treat them differently than you did other animals? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Hmm. I know with -- like with the moose and the caribou bones, they said we have to throw them in the water. They said they're thirsty. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: They are thirsty? MS. EVELYN MIKE: But with the seal -- seal bones, you throw them on land. I never knew the whole thing with that, you know, you just do it. And... MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Anything special about fish bones? Did you have to treat fish bones differently? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: No? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Huh-uh. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did you -- do you remember your dad going out hunting like seal or bear or? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I just remember moose. I don't know -- I don't know if he went out seal hunting much. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What about caribou? Do you remember caribou around as a child? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. Just moose. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Just moose? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: When you were a child, your dad was working at the store -- I mean at the school, so you guys didn't go out camping around and you guys were all going to school, too. There must have been other things, though, that you would go harvesting, like berries? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. Berries are big time. Big time now, we've got freezers. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Before you had freezers, how would you store the berries? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Hmm. I remember mom would find, I think, a durable plastic container. She didn't go out and shop for it, whatever came into it, like maybe plastic buckets. I remember her mixing just the shortening and the berries without any sugar. She would mix them up, fill up that five-gallon bucket, and go bury it. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: In the cool ground? MS. EVELYN MIKE: In the cool ground. And with salmonberries, I don't know if she mixed it in that shortening or if she just put it in there and then she melted Crisco. And then she would pour it right on top the -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Of the berries? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Of the salmonberries, and she would go bury the salmonberries. One day she tried to save blueberries and she made wine, I guess. I remember asking her if I could taste it, and she told me nope. I know she added lard and sugar, but I guess it was in after, you know, the blueberry season. She said, well, I guess I'm not going to do it that way.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: She was raised by Louise Wassillie. And I remember my mom telling us one time when we were out picking there was (inaudible) in sackcloth, but they would wait, before they -- I think before they would pick them or when it frosted or something, and they would pick the berries and (inaudible.) I guess back then once it froze, it stayed frozen. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: They would put it like in a sack and hang them in the cache, or -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: I don't know where they would put them. But I just remember her telling me that they put them in sack cloth and stored them, I guess, in the cache. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: When you do fish, when you -- you guys cook your fish, when you were a young girl and maybe you do it the same way now, I don't know if you've seen changes in how you take fish, or how you fixed your fish, but did you put like buckets of heads and stomachs and -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. I think before I got into it, they used to salt the -- salt the belly part. I haven't seen it. There might be some women who still do it because I would see the belly parts missing off their fish. But I just remember mom salting heads. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What do you call that? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Salunuk (phonetic). And the meat, she would salt them in buckets and then she smoked them. We didn't freeze very much because we didn't have electricity. And when we did, you know, it just wasn't big enough for us to run the freezer. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: When you were -- well, let me change the train of thought. When you would go fall fishing, where would you go get fish spawned out from the fall? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, there's Gibraltar Lake. I think it must be about maybe six, seven miles back, south of the bay. It's a big lake. You can get them there. But I didn't start going up there until I was like a teenager, after I got a Honda. And it was just mostly my mom and dad, Mary. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: They would take their dogs up there? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. They would take the Hondas up there. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Oh, with the Hondas they would go? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. And I guess we started doing that once we got transportation. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Maybe they used to go up camping in the fall. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah, she used to say my Aapa would go up there and camp. Mike Newyaka. He would go up there and he would broil his fish over the fire. But anyway, back to that fish, there's these two lakes -- there's two ponds up there. You have to cross the river and go through the ponds, and that's when you get -- that's where you get your fish. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: That's at Gibraltar, then? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, that's Gibraltar. And you can either cut them up there and haul them back. I think that's what mom and dad did because it's much lighter than the whole fish. But we had dogs, so if you split them up there, take the backbone and the heads, and use that for dog pot. And I guess there's enough sea gulls up there to get the guts, too.

MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did you go over to the other side, over like to Kokhanok River or Copper River or? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. The only kind of boat my dad had was this big old conversion. And that was just used for fishing, moving us back and forth to fish camp and Kokhanok. But I remember one time, I don't know, we went up the bay somewhere. I think it was the berry picking. I just remember we got stuck. I don't remember the place. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: (Inaudible.) MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. And that's -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: But mainly you guys stayed right here in the village? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: When your brothers were old enough to start hunting, were they already using Honda by then? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. They had these -- they would go out hunting with maybe Uncle Pete or with Elia Ignaty or maybe with Willie. They used a skiff and they would go with them. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Around the lake? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. Sometimes they would walk back, I guess. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And go down towards Big Mountain? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: That direction? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. Dennis Creek. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Dennis Creek? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do you remember as a young girl, or since you've been in the village, you know, a young girl and now, not so young? MS. EVELYN MIKE: But still young. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do you remember difference in terms of outsiders coming in the village, sports fishermen, sports hunters, that kind of thing? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I guess the plane made everybody mobile. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: You've always known planes, right? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I've always -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: (Inaudible.) MS. EVELYN MIKE: But we don't see them as much as we used to now. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: You don't see people? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Or we don't see the sports fishermen. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Oh. MS. EVELYN MIKE: We never used to back then. I just, you know, lodges had these planes, had these big Beavers that would fly in any kind of weather maybe. Otters. I'm seeing them a lot more. I think more because maybe tourism is developing. Sport fishing. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do they ever come down, like, to your fish camp or places that you go that, you know -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: I used to see them up in Gibraltar. I guess I've seen them in Gibraltar. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do they land on that lake on floats? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Is it big enough to land on? MS. EVELYN MIKE: It's big enough to land on floats. And my mom has an allotment there. I'm just learning now within the past probably five years that you can charge people to come through. And there used to be a lodging, never paid a cent to my mother for these fishermen to walk through her property to get to the river. I think within the past 10 years, we've seen a big influx. With this new lodge up here, the High Country one, if it's real nice weather, they have people coming down to the Gibraltar, the mouth of the Gibraltar River. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do they take them by boat or by plane? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, they take them by boat. And now you have lodges who land at Gibraltar Lake and they have floaters come down the river.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: And so it's a lot more traffic. That sort of thing. It's kind of different to see because I've -- I've been living in fish camp, gosh, all my life, and not the entire village moves down. There's just my sister and her little cabin, ours, my Uncle Pete and them, and probably Mary Nelson. Just four families now. So for the longest time, I kept thinking, you know, because I moved down there, I sort of think like I own that place. They -- they didn't really associated with us. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: The sports fishermen? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. They -- some of them don't even have the common courtesy to say hello. I guess the clientele has really changed. And since my mom's the property owner, this -- this past summer has been quite busy for me. I've had to deal with lodge owners. One day, though, I felt like just fencing up my mom's property. It's -- it's a big headache. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: How do they know that you're a property owner? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Well, remember how -- well, they say they don't know. Maybe it's -- maybe it's my fault. But then I was talking to one of them, he said, well, you know, we try to find out who -- how you own property. And he said, that -- it's not easy. And so within the -- let's see, within three years, we had that -- well, I can't remember how -- how many years we've had this bigger airport now. And there's a trail. Okay. Some of my mom's property, you know, is between the airport and the river. And a lot of people, think, ah, shortcut. And I suppose I would be thinking the same way. So I would have to go up there and say, you know, I'm sorry, this is private property. And if you're willing to pay just to cross, then you're allowed to go through. And I haven't -- and I've just started getting into it like within the past three years because now I overlook all my mom's matters and my dad's. And -- and it's really -- it hasn't been easy. She's getting on in her years where she's you know, really starting to resent people she don't know, right, coming through her property. And so I've been really busy with trying to contact the -- all the lodge owners who come around that area.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: And hopefully it will all work out. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. So, you're not sure that -- you're personally not sure that the trade-off of, say, more tourism is worth it, you'd rather have just your -- just yourself back, your property back? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Whether I like it or not, it's here, it's here. What I'm trying to do is get the best for my mother. Because all these years I've seen her with this attitude, like I've -- I've seen some lodges come in and they just, like, ferry their -- or shuttle their clients right up that trail over up to here. And those lodge owners, they talk about expenses and all, I believe they have expenses. No business wouldn't, they always have this overhead. And but gosh, for 20 years I watched my mom sit back and say, just leave them alone, with a real defeated attitude. And I'm just not going to put up with it anymore because it's not right that she shouldn't be getting anything. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Where are most of these lodges based? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, I think some in Iliamna. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Iliamna? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. There's some up in Nondalton, there's some in Port Alsworth, on the Kvichak River. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. Do you think having Lake Clark National Park and Katmai National Park has made a difference in terms of the lodging, the lodge? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I have no idea. All I know is this year that I have never seen so much planes. And I think -- I think maybe the -- the water level has something to do with it because at Gibraltar, like all of a sudden this past year, it's been discovered. And if you look at it on the south shore, it's the only major river. And I was talking to these fellows up who have a lodge up at the bay, they said the creeks up there are dry. I've never seen this lake so low. Pretty low. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Yeah. A lot of people have said that. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. It's the lowest -- the lowest I've ever seen it. And one day just this past summer, I counted 21 people fishing off at Gibraltar -- mouth of the Gibraltar River. Could you imagine 21 people? Triple fish camp population that day. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do they just park their planes on the beach down there? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. There's really not much you can do because it's -- the mean high water level is just as confusing as it sounds. And you know, there's not much -- like this lodge goes right outside my mamma's beach. And those Beavers aren't quiet. They are noisy. Talk about the noise level. And there's not much you can do, technically.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: And so it's just like you got me when I'm down, yeah, but we're not going to have low water forever. But I think the lodge is just -- lodge is just -- lodge owners are realizing that hey, there's a woman that -- that has property. And, well, it took them 20 years, I guess, to realize that they are, from the time that -- you know that land -- land that -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: (Inaudible.) MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, when everyone was allotted, what, 160 acres. And so it's been -- it's been a headache. But I think those people are starting to realize that, you know, that there's somebody out there bothering them. I don't get a -- I don't get a cut out of anything what my mom gets from the lodges. You know, whatever she settles with, you know, it's hers. I'm just -- you know, I'm just tired of seeing her with this real defeated attitude. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What about hunters? Do you guys get hunters up here? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Not that I recall. I know, what, Bruin Bay, because Sam and Ray Madrid, they talk about tide (indiscernible) over in Bruin Bay. I haven't -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Pretty much they don't come through the village and bug you -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Not that -- not that I know of. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: (Inaudible.) MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. I think it's bad enough with sports fishermen. I don't want hunters in. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Have you ever hunted yourself? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: No? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I thought about it, but, you know, I don't know what part to shoot at because if I -- if I don't get a clean hit, you know, I would be thinking, oh, I'm letting the animal suffer. So I just leave that to my brothers. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And they take care of it? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I have to put it away and clean it. That's one thing I don't like to do. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: But they do the hunting? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, they do the hunting, yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do they take their skidoos or their -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Hondas. Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- Hondas and go back behind the village? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do you know if they used to go in one day and back or did they ever have to overnight? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I remember Martin Wassillie and Nick Newyaka overnighting because they got lost way back there. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: It wasn't planned? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, it wasn't planned, but you know, there in the back of your mind, you're always worried, but these guys, I think they know what they are doing. They have been at it for years. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Have you ever heard your dad talk about going over or your mom going over to Amakdedori? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. I remember oh -- I remember my mom and Mary used to go beachcombing. They used to get John Nielsen to fly them over in his Skicraft. And I -- and one year, my Aapa, Nick Wassillie, my dad and I think my brother Nick went over there, and they camped over there. I think that they got the same person to bring them over, John Nielsen. I don't know how long. And his kids used to go up there, too, and camp. Gwen, Garry, my brother Johnny. I don't know who was the other one. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: You don't -- you don't remember your dad or mom talking about people ever living over there or anything?

MS. EVELYN MIKE: She talked about somebody, but I don't know if it was in Amakdedori. But I think she was talking about her grandma. Somebody was camping over there, she said her grandma, I think it was her brother. And she said -- she said something about her grandma being hungry. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: And they had to cut up -- I don't know what kind of animal skin, and chew on that. Chew on it. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: (Inaudible.) MS. EVELYN MIKE: Something. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did your parents ever talk to you about how to take care of yourself if there was ever like fish famine or if there wasn't enough food? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No, they didn't. But I remember them old-timers, she always said the old-timers told you that when there's food to gather, you don't lie around. If there's fish to put up, you put it up. And I think a lot of times it was the fish that tied them over because I remember even being younger, when I was younger when sometimes they didn't get any moose. I remember having to live on fish all the time. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What about some of the other kinds of food, like porcupine -- well, you said squirrel, but you guys as children didn't eat squirrel. What about porcupine? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Well, we ate that but they only came like in the spring and summer. And even then, this summer we didn't see any. I don't know what's become of them. But there's ducks, there's -- I remember my dad going ptarmigan hunting. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Can you do that year around or (inaudible). MS. EVELYN MIKE: I remember ptarmigan in the wintertime. Because I used to go with him back behind Airplane Lake and there's this brush here. I guess -- I guess they were supposed to because we did not have that much kind of Hondas to scare them off. And I remember him telling me to try to find the -- find the ptarmigan in the brush. But it was camouflaged with the snow, and I had the longest time. I don't know why he sent me in the brush. Maybe because I was smaller. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Probably because you didn't have the gun. MS. EVELYN MIKE: And rabbits. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Would they snare rabbits or would they shoot them? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Mostly snare. My mom used to snare rabbits. But I liked it when she made rabbit stew or when she baked the rabbit, oh, they were delicious. But you know, there was so much dogs around back even before I started coming -- going to high school, she would set snare, and she would have a catch but the dogs would always get into it. And so she doesn't do that anymore. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: And I remember trying to -- William, he always wanted to be a hunter. Seemed like all the little boys are like that. At a certain age, they want to be hunters.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: Then of all people to ask him to go hunting or set snares was me. So we found a couple -- you know, those picture wires, and we got my sister Mary to show us how she made hers, or my mom. And we would go ask my sister Annie, how the heck do we set them? Why we asked Annie, I don't know. He was like -- William was like 7. So that had to make me about, what, maybe 24, 25. Because I never went with my mom. She always -- the only one she took was Mary because probably Mary -- maybe Mary didn't pester her as much as we did.

MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- in Kokhanok, and this is Judith Morris. And so you were talking about snaring rabbits with your -- with your nephew William. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Learning how to do that and using picture wire. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What about beaver? Did your mom and dad trap beaver or shoot beaver? MS. EVELYN MIKE: My dad trapped beaver, but he didn't do it like year around. Because I remember -- I remember for a while they -- they didn't trap beaver. Maybe because there wasn't much. And then when they started coming around, then they got into it. Maybe that was maybe 20 years. Something like that. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did he sell his pelts? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. I remember him -- I don't even know how much he got. He would send it to -- I don't even know what company. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Over at Iliamna or -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Anchorage? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Anchorage or -- I don't know, someplace over there. My mom always used to trap mink, you know, during winter. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Excuse me. And that was how she got -- I guess, supplemented her income. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And she would send those -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. She would send those -- I don't even remember where. I remember just labeling them for her, the address label. Because I can't remember the name of the company. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. Did she run that trap line by herself? Was it near the village or did she go out with her dogs or? MS. EVELYN MIKE: She started when -- I remember her using a Honda. And so I had to be a teenager then. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: I think she was real busy raising us when we were going to school, you know, because we used to have to go home and have lunch. And then as, you know, the hot lunches came in, then all of us were in school, that gave her time to do what she wanted, and trapping was one of them. And it was one way that she could earn some income because she was just housewife. And her and my sister Mary would also buddy up and do things like that. The -- she would do it someplace by that big hill on the river bank, that big hill behind fish camp. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: In that area. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. But she didn't cross the river, then, she stayed on -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: No, she didn't. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- this side of the -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: She stayed on this side. And I remember I used to go with her and check some of her sets. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What did she use for bait, do you know? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. I didn't pay attention to that, but -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: She was using metal traps? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Metal trap. I think it was number 2 she used to use mink, number 2 trap. And she'd just follow the river. I don't know how many -- how many traps she had on her trap line. Then she would try for a lynx. Couple times she got them. I don't know how -- I don't know what she was -- I just remember one time though she used turkey bones for bait -- bait. And -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What about wolf? Do you remember your mom and dad ever trying to track wolf or wolverines?

MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. I never did see a live wolf, except one time across the river. My dad shot one, but my mom never trapped for any of them. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: You were talking about you would sometimes have ducks or, I don't know, geese -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-huh. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- or cranes -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-huh. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- what kinds of different birds you would get. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Can you get those both in the spring and the fall or is it just certain seasons you get those? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, spring, fall, somewhere around there. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What about eggs, going out and gathering eggs off the island? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah, that goes on every -- every spring. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do you go out more than once or -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. Because there's -- in our family now there's 12. And that's a big number. So we go out whenever we can. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Are the eggs available for one month or two months or? MS. EVELYN MIKE: This year has been unusual because I remember when I used to go out and do it, you know, I used to get real excited about going egg hunting. Now it's like... We would go like sometime after the first week of June. But man, I never saw big sea gull eggs being laid. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: This year? MS. EVELYN MIKE: May -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Oh, really? MS. EVELYN MIKE: The last week of May. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Wow. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Everything was early. I don't know if the weather had anything to do with it. And we would at least try for five gallons. Because mom loves sea gull eggs. As long as she's got sea gull eggs, she's going to cook them for breakfast. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Okay. How does she store them? MS. EVELYN MIKE: She keeps them in her smoke house. She keeps them in buckets in her smoke house where it's cool enough. Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Does she pour anything over them? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Oil or water. MS. EVELYN MIKE: She just keeps it at. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Anything like that? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: There's no grass on them or anything? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. She just lines the bottom with either grass or moss. And just fills the eggs up then and just keeps it in the smoke house. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did they talk to you ever about when to stop picking eggs or how you know that there's -- that you've picked enough? MS. EVELYN MIKE: There's a certain time, but I never paid attention to that. I wish I did. I know usually my brothers, my brothers are the ones that know, like Nick and Johnny, because they are always out there. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Maybe -- maybe the second week in June. Maybe. But I'm not too sure. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So it's not a real long period to gather eggs? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. Huh-uh. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do you go out to these islands -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- like to these fish camp islands? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, these ones here. All those islands you see out there. Then some over towards Tommy Point. There is this one island, oh, the sea gulls lay eggs there. My family calls it Sammy's Island. It's right outside by -- it's like in the middle of the lake out -- right outside by Big Mountain.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: Once we tried to go there and it was Sammy Wassillie, his wife, and his family beat us to that island. So we dubbed it Sammy's Island. I got to tell him about that. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. Uh-hum. Do you -- when you think about the food you were eating as a young girl, compared to what you're eating now, what you feed, you know, your nephews and everything -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- do you think your diet has changed a lot? MS. EVELYN MIKE: There's still meat and there's still fish, but you know, the little things like maybe the fiddlehead ferns. My mamma didn't eat that. I think I would rather have that than any of the vegetables because it tastes better. But my brothers are -- we just aren't into vegetables. Maybe that's why we're anemic. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Does your mom still go out and get any fertile -- fertile heads -- fiddlehead ferns? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. But, this year -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And other kinds of wild plant? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Well, the weather being so dry, the fiddlehead -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Fiddlehead. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Fiddlehead ferns just sprouted fast even before she got to have one. And wild rhubarb, I think. No. I don't know what you call them. But she would mix them up with shortening and sugar, just like a dessert. It's just been really dry that they haven't grown. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did she -- maybe when you were younger and even now, did she ever, if you had colds or if you were sick, did she ever give you medicine from, like, wild plants? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. The one we call caiggluk. Caiggluk. I don't know what the name for it. Bitter tasting stuff. I mean, whenever you had cough it was like you tried to hide it from your mom because you don't want to drink it. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: She would cook it up and -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Cook it up, just boil it like tea. And I remember her using that more than anything. And I think it's called coltsfoot. You know, the real floppy green leaves. She would dig up the roots. And she would chew on it or make us chew on it if we had sore throat. It was, oh, that stuff is bitter. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Must be something to it, though. MS. EVELYN MIKE: And those were the two I remembered. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Does she still use them? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. She still uses them, although we haven't found any of them. It's been really dry. And so I think that's the reason why I don't have as much. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Does she store them through the winter? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, she just dries them just like you dry stuff. And then if she needs to use them, you know, she just breaks it off and boils it.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: I don't think she's used other kinds. Not that I can remember right now. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: In the '60s when you were growing up, did you have -- I'm trying to think of the things you may have had. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did you have a generator? MS. EVELYN MIKE: That came later. I can't remember when we had a generator. I remember being small and when it was -- maybe when I was 8. I remember a generator when I was 8. But then that broke down. And then I guess it was awhile until my dad got -- was able to afford another one. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: When -- before you lived in HUD house up on the road now from this high road, but before that, did you live down by the beach? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. We -- our log house was maybe not even 50 feet away from the beach at high water. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did it ever flood? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. I remember it -- I think I remember it twice. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: From high winds and -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: There was just a lot of rain that year. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: A lot of rain? MS. EVELYN MIKE: A lot of rain. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So if you were living close to the water, did you haul your water from the lake for drinking and cooking and -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: I think my dad got it from someplace else. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Not the -- not the lake? MS. EVELYN MIKE: We -- we always hauled water from the lake. We still do. Now we're finally starting to drink that water that we get. But sometimes the boys, they haul water from the lake and use it in their steam bath because that chlorine, if you -- it really dries you out. But I remember -- I always remember dad hauling water. But when we -- you know, when it flooded, I don't think he went right outside our beach, I think he went -- went down a ways. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. Uh-hum. Was that sort of a man's job or a boy's job to haul water? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I think it was, but you got somebody like my sister or me who did anything, I guess, you know, I don't see nothing wrong with it, but I guess now I'm starting to pay for it. My knees ache, my back aches, my arms ache. You know, that sort of thing. It's okay to do it but I don't think women were built for heavy lifting. Because those five-gallon buckets, I heard a gallon can weigh up to 8 pounds. So if you're -- if you're hauling five gallons, think about 40 -- 40 pounds each arm -- on an arm. It gets heavy. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And in the winter, you cut holes in the ice. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And did you go ice fishing? Did your mom go ice fishing? MS. EVELYN MIKE: My mom used to go ice fishing a lot because, you know, I remember seeing Annie Dee, when the snow was drifting, do ice fishing. Because, you know, we didn't have freezers back then.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: And moose season was in December, and sometimes you didn't get -- get a moose. So she -- I remember Annie Dee would be out there fishing, you know, fishing. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Would she be just out there on the lake or -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- would she fish at school -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: She'd -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- Schoolhouse Lake -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: She'd like go -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- or Airplane Lake? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, I remember mom -- I remember seeing Annie Dee there. I remember mom going there. I remember mom going to Airplane Lake and walking as far down to fish camp. Mom and Mary Nowatok, they used to hitch up the dog team and they would go ice fishing. But that was like in -- towards the spring. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: When there was more light? MS. EVELYN MIKE: More light. And when they bite more, I guess. Because during the winters, I don't think they bite as much. You're lucky if you get one. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And they were getting trout and Dolly Varden? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did you ever go pike fishing? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Once. When my brother was about maybe five and I had to be like eight or nine. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And would you go over there, over -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: We went to -- I don't know what lake you call it. By Jack Holdigger's place. That's where we went. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: But it crossed over, across the bay? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No, it's on this shore, this side of the lake, the east side -- south side of the lake. You just go up to -- I don't know how far that is. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Take your boat and go? MS. EVELYN MIKE: We went in -- I think it was -- I can't remember when we went. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So you went on the ice? MS. EVELYN MIKE: We went on the ice. Yeah, it had to be spring, late spring. No, late winter, early spring. I didn't catch any. But boy, I was surprised to see what kind of line they used. String. Because mom said, they bite fast. And I was thinking, what do you mean they bite fast. She said, they bite hard. She said, you better use two hands. My brother fished at that one hole, and then I went with my mom and dad. I was my mom and dad's tail. You name it, they tried to go berry picking without me, I would see them up on a hill and I would run after them. I went with my mom and them to make another hole. Not even 15 minutes later there's my brother, my youngest brother coming across the lake. We thought he was towing his truck. He was towing a pike. Dragging it. And I was surprised, little five year old didn't let go. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What did you use to make the hole? MS. EVELYN MIKE: We used an ice pick. I always remembered the ice pick. Well, the one that my mom had, she's got one, Gregory Andrew used to have a store. I guess now it's kind of hard to find ice picks these days. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: They don't use augers? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. I remember them just using ice picks.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: And that was when the ice used to get really thick. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: You've seen the weather change? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yes. I've seen it -- I've seen it. The lake doesn't freeze up like it used to, like in, what, October, November or December. Now it's probably January, February. You have a cold snap maybe two weeks in February. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So does that hinder people moving around? It seems to me it might be easier travelling on ice than travelling on just part ice. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, I think so. A lot of ice fog. Because there's -- ice fog would sometimes be so thick, you can't even fly. Yeah, back then they used snow machine a lot. You know, these days, there's some guys that buy a brand new snow machine, don't use it until the next winter, or maybe you just have snow for maybe two weeks, then it turns to slush. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So you're saying that they would use it when it was slushy and maybe rocky, but there's some people who only want to use it on good snow? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I think snow machines are built much differently. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Oh, I see. MS. EVELYN MIKE: The ones that they have, they use slide rails, I think. And you -- I know with slide rails, you've got to have certain snow conditions, right? And I remember those old snow machines, I remember they had bogey wheels, seemed like they went on anything. You don't see that anymore except maybe on those 12-horse Elans. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So you always remember having snow machines around? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: But you do remember before they had Hondas? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. Used to be lots of dogs. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: People walk more before they had Hondas? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. In fact, when we were growing up, gosh, I didn't own -- I didn't own my own Honda until I was, I think, 18. Up until then, I was walking through the village to check mail. That used to be a big thing. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Where was the mail, Post Office? MS. EVELYN MIKE: At one time, it was at Fran's house, and then -- excuse me. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Her house now? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: You had to go down to (inaudible.) MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. Then I remember Feducia used to be Postmaster, and it was in that silver -- that silver building now outside of Fennie's. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: There. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So the mail, the Post Office kind of goes with whoever has the contract? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. I guess it goes like that. I guess now Kathy has it. You know. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: But you don't have, like, something that's called the Kokhanok Post Office? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, we do now. They had to remodel a watering point building. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Oh. MS. EVELYN MIKE: That's right through old Garry's house. Brown building. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: That's now the Kokhanok Post Office? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: This -- the summertime, the spring and summer is when we used -- we used to do a lot of walking. Excuse me. Walked to pick salmonberries. Walk -- walk up here. Because I don't think Hondas came in until about '78, '79. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do people worry about bears? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, but you know, you had to do what you had to do. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did you carry a gun with you? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, we always carried a gun. We didn't have to shoot one on our way up or on our way back. I remember being impressed with walking up to Kokhanok in 30 minutes. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And Kokhanok is what you call fish camp? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do you remember between -- between here, the village now, and fish camp, there is ruins of a church and a store up there? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I saw the roof of the church once. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do you remember your folks talking about that at all? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Mom said -- she didn't -- she doesn't like us taking that -- there's -- there's a fork, you know, off the old truck trail, she does not like us taking -- okay, if you're heading down the left fork, out of respect for all those graves, because she said there's a lot of people buried down on the bank. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Who was buried there? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I guess she said when everybody got sick, there was a lot of people that died. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: From the flu? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Probably, yeah, the flu. She said -- that whole beach there, where the old church used to be, we have grave sites there. There's some grave sites across the river. You know, my dad -- I think one of them is my dad's brother because my -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Across the river you mean in Gibraltar over there? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. My Grampa Johnny and my grandma lived over there. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And they are buried over there? MS. EVELYN MIKE: My grandma is just lying right out here at the church cemetery. My grampa, someplace in -- (phone ringing) -- up there. I don't know. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Okay. So your grampa you think is someplace in Washington? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. Because I remember Uncle Pete saying something that they sent him. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: This is old Johnny Mike -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. Sending him a picture of the cemetery where he was laying, but how Grampa Johnny ended up way down there, I don't know. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: And I don't know where my -- my maternal grandparents are buried. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: When your -- when your parents moved to the village or when they got married and were young people here, were they living here, on this site now, the village site now, or were they -- did they ever live down at that old site? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I think they were down the beach. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: About where everybody was before they moved up the hill? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: I think there. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: You don't know who was at that old place? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: At the old church? MS. EVELYN MIKE: The old church, no, I don't know who. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And how long ago that may have been there? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. Well, the new church we have, I think -- I think that's the first one we had. Because the first one I think was way down there at the bank, you know, the old -- old graveyard site. And then the other one was just someplace down here at the end of Slopagain Lake on the west side. And then we had this -- I think that's the third one up on -- up on top of the hill now, this new one we have. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: You have the new one. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. Those are the only ones I remember. And I don't know how old I was when I found out that about that old church way down there. I just remember my mom showing me once. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And so she skirts the village, she doesn't want to go through that area with the grave sites? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Well, she follows that one road that takes -- if the grassy part is the right fork going down. Sometimes I get lazy and I take that other one. Then I remember my mom says, you shouldn't go that way. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Because of the -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Of the -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: And before you -- you know that white picket fence? MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Yes. MS. EVELYN MIKE: When you're coming in from the airport? MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Yeah. MS. EVELYN MIKE: I don't know who's lying there. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Yeah. It's right by the hangar -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- that place there? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Yeah. I've walked over there by the runway. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. I don't know who's lying there. And we have some -- my Aapa, Mike Newyaka, fish camp. He -- there's another graveyard there. And there's my two sisters, Sasha and Marie. And I remember mom saying Okalina's dad, Pete Mike. And I just remember my Aapa. I can't remember who else had the other one. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Yeah. MS. EVELYN MIKE: But they are lying there. Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: At fish camp? MS. EVELYN MIKE: At fish camp across from that little -- from that little pond. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Well, people used to spend quite a bit of time at fish camp, didn't they? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So if somebody got sick or, you know, passed along there? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. I remember that's where they buried my Aapa. I was like 9. I remember him being sick. And he died when all the men had gone fishing. And I guess it was my sister Annie and my Aapa's daughter, I think Mary Nelson, that dressed him and got him ready for his casket. I don't know who built the casket.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: I remember my dad coming up, my Uncle Joe, Willie, Anesia, and Nick. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: They came up from fishing? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did they fly up? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I think they did. Because that was the quickest way. I don't know who flew them up. Maybe they came on a float plane. I'm not sure. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Who would conduct the service for something like that? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I remember only, see, there was -- we didn't have a priest. Nowadays we have a priest. Back then, you know, you just -- you just said those prayers. You know, I -- I wasn't paying attention to them. I just remember them bringing Aapa to the graveyard, you know, doing the last kiss when they laid him down in the ground, and I remember they buried him. Then Nick G's was the same way. I think I don't remember -- I don't remember how old he was. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Nick Olympic? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. He was my old Sunday school teacher. Same way. It was hot, though, that day. Oh, it was hot. They just brought him in the church. I don't even remember if they sang. And they took him out and they buried him. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did they have any special ceremonies or anything like when -- like one year anniversary after somebody's died? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Not that I recall. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: I don't know -- the first time I ever seen a -- a dead baby was my Aanana's, my Auntie, Mary Nowatok's. But then I heard that was Agofia's baby that my Aanana had adopted. And I remember my mom says, we're going to go see the baby. The baby died. And I said, what does "died" mean? She brought me to my Aanana's, and I remember I was wondering how come they let the baby sleep on the floor. Because, you know, I was young. I remember grass on there, black cloth, big -- a big rock at the foot. And black covering him. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: How did -- do you know how names -- did they have -- I don't know now, but maybe some time ago, do you remember if -- if people were given names for particular reasons where -- were you named for a recently passed on relative? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Or did certain families own names or anything? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. I think you were just given a name. Like I was named after my grandma. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And it didn't matter whether that person was living or. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Huh-uh. I think it was basically after they died. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: After they died? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Because I -- you know, I see the naming thing, it's hours after someone that died. Not for someone that was living.

MS. JUDITH MORRIS: When you think about growing up, we sort of started this before, but when you think about growing up in the '60s and you see the '90s now and you have running water and electricity and satellite TV and all these different changes, what do you think has been the biggest change? What's made the biggest difference between when you were growing up and how your nieces and nephews are growing up? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I think just the technology. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: The technology? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. Because, you know, like you say, you can, you know, turn the TV on and you can see what's going on in the other parts of the world. You can pick up the phone there and you could talk to some foreign country. And like today, I was telling you that my brother -- my nephew William and Jason were going on this -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Government? MS. EVELYN MIKE: The government training camp. Well, I found the number to that guy because he had an office in Fairbanks. His name is Matt Galvono (phonetic). He's the camp director. And I know that camp was going to be in Wasilla. And I can't remember the name of the center. So I called up directory, got a number to that facility, and the lady at the facility gave me a number to the camp director. You know, back then, I wouldn't have been able to do that. He wouldn't have been able to know that we missed it because of bad weather. I think it's just the technology. Aviation. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What things do you see remaining the same? MS. EVELYN MIKE: With certain families, subsistence. Like the sharing. Sometimes you don't see it that much, the sharing. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do you think freezers have made a difference in sharing? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yes. I tell you I wouldn't -- I don't know how I went without a freezer. But yeah, I'm able to, like, store my food. I don't have to buy all that store meat. Freeze fish and have it in December. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: You like fresh fish in December? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, sort of. But I say if I was to think about it, I would say it's technology. But electricity is one of the greatest conveniences, because I think it's the best thing in my house. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Better than running water? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, that was a long time coming because before we got running water, you wouldn't believe it, sometimes my mother used over 30 gallons of water every day. I felt sorry for my brother Moses who did most of the packing, so I, you know, would pack water for him. Trade off, you wash dishes, I'll pack water for you.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: She's always cooking, you know? She's always got kettles boiling. She's always drinking tea. You know. So as long as I remember my mom, it's her fishing and cooking. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What things would you think have stayed the same, though, in the village? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Gee, that's kind of hard to say. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Well, you said subsistence. MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, there's some families. My family, we still do subsistence. You know, I don't know how I would feed my family if I -- if I didn't go out and get fish, get berries, hunt. Because if I was to just, like, buy all my frozen stuff, maybe we'd eat -- maybe we'd only eat for two weeks out of the month. Because freezer is expensive to get shipped in. And I don't know what else. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What about social life? Do you think that's changed with, like, TV and stuff? Do you think people visit as much as they used to? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. Socializing is different. It's -- people are homebodies. I think jobs got something to do with that, too. Because I'm a big homebody now. And I don't travel anywhere unless it's to Anchorage. I don't have time to do that. No, people don't -- don't visit as much as they used to. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: That's within the village? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And then outside the village, to friends and relatives elsewhere, too? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, if there's a boat ride going in, if there's -- if there's somebody going on a boat going somewhere, yeah, you'll go. But I don't get to go very often because I'm so darn busy. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Well, you work at the school, right? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, nine months out of the year, yes. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And how long have you worked there? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh. Last May I think I ended my 14th year. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Is that a change of the school here employing local people to work in the school? MS. EVELYN MIKE: The school is the biggest employee. You know, you've got the -- you have the cook, you've got two aides. You've got the maintenance man, the primary one, and then you've got a custodian. So that's five jobs right there. Oh, you've got a -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Preschool? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, preschool. Then -- preschool needs to be certificated. Until -- you know, there was only two sites, I guess. And I could see that point of view saying like, well, how come these two sites got certificated and all the rest don't. And the recreation aide, you know, out of that drugs and alcohol kind of awareness thing where you have the gym open. So that's like seven positions right there.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: You got your classified staff. No, you've got your certified staff. That's all the teachers. And oh, yeah, the secretary. I think there's eight positions right there. We've seen a big enrollment. We finally got an addition. It feels like we finally have some room to breathe. Our one program that's appropriate like with K-1 or -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did you stay home for high school? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Two years I went to Naknek. I think that's where I first met you. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: And then my mom had me come back. I think after Molly Hootch won her case is when you started seeing all these smaller high schools come out. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Uh-hum. MS. EVELYN MIKE: And so -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Do you think it's good that the kids get to stay home now through high school? MS. EVELYN MIKE: You know, there's -- in any situation there's always advantages and disadvantages. The advantages is you get to keep your family together. And the biggest disadvantage is just having the -- what's that class where you don't have as much -- you don't have variety of classes. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So you don't have as much electives? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah, that sort of thing. And the classes you give are just, I think, the requirements. You don't have as much electives. Sometimes you don't have enough kids to socialize with. But I think, more or less, education is what you make of it. What you get out of it. What you put into it. And what you want to get out of it. It doesn't matter if it's big or small. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did your brothers go out to school also? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Did they go to Naknek or -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. My oldest one went to someplace in Oklahoma. And I can't even remember the name of the school. My second oldest brother, someplace in Oregon. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Chemawa? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Chemawa? MS. EVELYN MIKE: And they graduated. Then my brother went to some two year -- my oldest one went to a two-year college. I can't even remember where. Kansas maybe. That's about it. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What do you see for your nieces and nephews, you know, down the road? Do you see them -- like, would your family encourage them to go out and get educated in a trade school or a college? Do you feel secure in Kokhanok continuing as it is or do you see that the younger people are going to have less options? More options? I'm just curious. MS. EVELYN MIKE: You know, I often thought about that, you know. I never thought that eight -- 15 years is going to come with a blink of an eye, but it did.

MS. EVELYN MIKE: I think when I first started, we were trying to complete -- compete nationally. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Educationally you mean? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. Nationally. It's now like overnight here, it's global. Because, you know, right in fisheries alone, you've got to deal with the Japanese. You know, that's one aspect. But I think I prefer my kids to go to trade school because I don't think we're teaching college courses, or what's that thing, college entry, or -- I don't think -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: College level courses. MS. EVELYN MIKE: I don't think our education right now as it is is geared towards college. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So you think the children living here will have a hard time adapting or? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I had the darnedest time. And I think I was pretty secure. First year, my first semester, I barely made passing. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: This is in college -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- or high school? MS. EVELYN MIKE: College. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Where did you go to college? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I went to Fairbanks. Then I went to Anchorage. Then, oh, messed up there, and got my sights set back on. But, you know, I graduated valedictorian here. But I struggled. I mean, I struggled. And so that tells you something about our courses. And I think there's only one that I know of that graduated from college is Gwennie. And I know she had to work real hard at it. And I think we're -- I think we're better off with trade school. You know, because, I look back at our kids, look at my nieces and nephews, I don't know if they could do it. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: You were talking about, you know, dealing with the land issues with your mom -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- and her private property -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- and outsiders coming in. Do you see land issues affecting the village in terms of -- it seems to me that a long time ago, if I've heard stories about some of the families coming here, they had to ask permission from the chief -- MS. EVELYN MIKE: Uh-hum. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: -- to get to live here, and I don't know how you would do that now if an outsider wanted to come in here, I don't know how that would be handled. MS. EVELYN MIKE: I think you would have to go through the government entity. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Through the Village Council? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Rather than through the chief? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Yeah. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: What about other issues facing the village in terms of where you use land or where you go hunting? Do you see that being different? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I wish it could just stay the same, but it's not because...

MS. EVELYN MIKE: ...you have people, you know, using land in a different way like us, we're more subsistence oriented. We will always be. And the people that probably are thorns right now are probably all the sportsmen because they just do it for sports. And I think whoever has the loudest voice is going to be the one that's going to get what they want out of it. But -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: So do you feel threatened in your way of life? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I never really thought about that because, you know, I haven't seen many changes except for regulations like -- like hunting. I haven't seen -- I don't think bag limits have changed. But -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Has it -- has ORV's been affected? I mean, your -- your Hondas, they let you use Hondas wherever? MS. EVELYN MIKE: Oh, yeah, I use them. We use them. Where I feel that -- I guess I don't feel as threatened as, like, let's say, somebody from South Naknek. Because, you know, they are right in that Bristol Bay Borough, and they think, you know -- to me, South Naknek is just like Kokhanok, it's a village. And they lead a subsistence way of life. And I think people in that kind of situation are going to feel it much more than I am. And I hope it's not because that's what I need to live on. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: I was just thinking about that. MS. EVELYN MIKE: That's an interesting questions. I haven't looked at the regulations lately to see if there's any change in bag limits. Are we done? MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Yeah. Is there anything else you want to say? MS. EVELYN MIKE: No. I think I -- MS. JUDITH MORRIS: You think you're finished? MS. EVELYN MIKE: I think I'm finished. MS. JUDITH MORRIS: Thanks, Evelyn. It's been fun. (End of recorded session.)